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Report 747
Report #747 Skillset: Harmonics Skill: Convoke Org: Institute Status: Rejected Dec 2011 Furies' Decision: We disagree that the skill is necessarily clunky or needs to have the resonance requirement removed. We are not inclined to make it a "clone" of other skills that exist or a faster version of summon. Problem: Convoke is the most clunky of the summoning abilities giving to the guardian archetype. Currently, it costs at minimum 8 power when accounting for the prerequisite resonance on the target. Beyond this, it is no better than summon in planar. Infact, it shares the exact mechanics of summon if no timewarp is brought into play. Convoke does decrease the amount of time it takes to complete the summon if the target is timewarped, but due to the burst nature of timewarp and the extremely quick healing of it, it is impractical that a target would ever be timewarped enough for this to make a difference. Comparing this to other guardian skills which can pull many people and split groups at no power cost, Convoke is vastly inferior in both single and group combat. Furthermore, as a class that has a major part of their offense cured by running, it is important that a researcher have the possibility of summoning someone back into their carcer and temporalbonds. 0 R: 0 Solution #1: Remove the resonance requirement for convoke. Create two syntaxes for convoke CRYSTALSPIN CONVOKE (Target) and CRYSTALSPIN CONVOKE (Target) FULL. Have the first syntax cost no power, and work as if the target has no timewarp now. The second syntax will cost 3 power, and cut the summon time in half regardless of timewarp level, and remove all timewarp from the target. Then, if the target does have resonance cause the convoke to not be stopped by the target moving (though it should still be stopped by monoliths and anything else that stops summon). 0 R: 0 Solution #2: Remove the resonance requirement. Leave the syntax as CRYSTALSPIN CONVOKE, cause it to have a beckon affect on all adjacent rooms for any target that does not have quicksilver up. 0 R: 0 Solution #3: Change it to a beckon skill with no other requirements, stopped by the same things as beckon and with no power cost Player Comments: ---on 12/14 @ 20:39 writes: Based on discussions on the Envoys channel that a 0p summon with no other requirements might be too strong (which I think is a valid concern), I propose this adjustment to Solution 1: Make it only work on adjacent rooms only, like Wisp. This would make it slower than wisp without the FULL syntax, but faster when using the FULL syntax for 3 power. Not sure if the extra resonance effect should be changed or not. ---on 12/14 @ 22:46 writes: If solution 1 has no range on it, I don't support it. ---on 12/16 @ 20:48 writes: Solution 3 is probably best ---on 12/16 @ 20:53 writes: I have no problem with solution 2 so long as it's single target, so I'd pick that one of the three suggested. Having it be wisp that requires resonance would be interesting though ---on 12/17 @ 00:54 writes: Disagree with all solutions provided. Solution 1 is a mixture of effects that are too strong (0p ranged summoning) and effects that are perplexingly useless (spending 3 power to make your summon movement-proof but not mono-proof). Solution 2 is interesting (summoning everyone, allies and enemies alike, but blocked by quicksilver), but does not solve the problems with the skill; everyone who you'd want to summon will have quicksilver up by the time you summon them. Solutionss 3 is balanced, but is a clone of an existing skill. I do like Shedrin's wisp-like idea, though. ---on 12/17 @ 22:02 writes: The resonance requirement really limits convoke, especially given the lack of alternative beckon-type abilities in Hallifax for separating groups in stand-off situations. For that reason, I would be against solution 2 too. Out of the suggested solutions, my preference would be for Solution #3, or Shedrin's ammended solution. ---on 12/26 @ 20:14 writes: Since about the only thing one -can- do against a researcher much of the time is 'run' (that's the only valid cure to some skills, and certain other skills have no cure at all except for sitting somewhere else and waiting for them to end), researchers really do -not- need an overly easy way to summon people back to them. Working to get to the point that you can use the skill is probably the only way to retain balance. ---on 12/26 @ 20:17 writes: Also, Wiccans have been trying to get Wisp to be more of a beckon-clone for a very long time now, given similar restraints that make it unuseable under most circumstances (requiring trees on both ends, when nobody is going to leave trees in their room excepting on Ethereal). It's pretty clear at this point that not all guilds are supposed to have summon skills of an equivalent nature or efficacy or general useability. ---on 12/26 @ 20:46 writes: Thus: No to group beckon effects (solution 2), no to straight up beckon clone (solution 3). Something could be done with sol 1, I'm not sure I like the solution provided as-is, especially as Wisp does have a power cost (1p per cast) -and- has the terrain requirements that leave it wanting. Any chance on trying to simplify the thing into one ability instead of the block of text and if / else statements that it currently is? ---on 12/26 @ 21:02 writes: I like Shedrin's modification to solution 1. I think most of us can agree that wisp needs some slight buffs (like maybe not requiring the target room to have trees) so I don't think this should necessarily be limited to where wisp stands now. ---on 12/26 @ 22:24 writes: Ok so I thought more about this. I think there's two issues in play here. One is anti-running, which is what Xenthos seems more concerned with, and one is group combat initiation/pickoff, which is where Beckon's use lies. As it is, Convoke functions like a (weak) initiation ability, but with a requirement more in line with anti-runner. Personally, I don't think Institute need much more in terms of anti-runner, and if they really desire something like that, they can go Tarot for Empress, Fall, etc. As an initiation skill, any requirement that the Researcher be in the room with the target beforehand to do something (timewarp, resonance, etc) defeats the point of the skill. ---on 12/26 @ 22:24 writes: As an initiator, it needs something to make it more effective than generally- available Summon. This can be achieved by removing the power cost and/or speeding it up. Making it like Beckon allows it fulfill both initiation and anti-running to an extent, which is noted to be too strong. Keeping it as a delayed summon limits the anti-running power of the ability, allowing a target to tumble out, and regain balance to drop a monolith or move more. Further, I feel that it should be fairly spammable in order to be effective in catching an unprepared opponent. ---on 12/26 @ 22:24 writes: Conclusion: Remove resonance requirement, make it faster than Summon, lower power cost, ala Solution 1. This makes it just a superior Summon, which has other uses than group combat stand-offs, so to limit that, the adjacent room requirement is proposed. In comparison to Wisp, I am inclined to agree with Wobou's comment that Wisp itself needs some buffs. ---on 12/30 @ 20:47 writes: That sounds fine, with the wisp conclusion as well.